Designing Meaning: The Art of the Story in Stone

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign. [00:00:05] Speaker B: Welcome to Monument Matters, a podcast produced by the Monument Builders of North America for all things memorialization. Each episode is an extension of our monthly magazine, MB News. Monument Matters invites everyone to listen and share. You'll find all of the episodes on Apple, Spotify, and YouTube. [00:00:24] Speaker A: I'm your host, Mike Johns, CM, AICA from the Johns Carabelli Company, Cimaral Cimarano Monuments and Flowers in Cleveland, Ohio. I'm also a past president of the Monument Pillars of North America. Today's episode is titled Designing meaning the Art of the Story in Stone. With me today to discuss this topic is my esteemed colleague and friend, Jed A. Henderson, cmfaica, retired owner of Santa Barbara Monumental in Santa Barbara, California, and executive Director of the American Institute of Commemorative Art, a role that he has held since 2012. Jed has held his Certified Memorialist designation since 1995 and is a Fellow of the Institute. He is a past president of mvna, and we are both currently serving on the committee creating MVNA's monument builders. Hello, Jed. Welcome to today's podcast. [00:01:27] Speaker C: Wonderful. Thank you for having me, Mike. [00:01:29] Speaker A: Absolutely. So, before we begin, I just want to circle back to what appears to be a contradiction. Are you retired or are you not? Why, after turning over the reins of your company, are you still involved in the monument industry? [00:01:44] Speaker C: Because I love it. I have more friends in the monument industry across the country than I do here in Santa Barbara. I just. I like my friends, so I like to be involved. [00:01:58] Speaker A: Well, we appreciate your involvement as well, Jed. Sometimes it's hard to let go, but, you know, it's. It's great when folks just continue to feel a need and a desire to give back. Right. [00:02:12] Speaker C: Yes. I will admit it was surprisingly easy to let go of my company. [00:02:20] Speaker A: I get it. All right, so, Jed, you're a fellow of the American Institute of Commemorative Art, an organization that's been advancing design standards in our industry since 1951. For listeners who aren't familiar with the AICA, can you give us a quick picture of what it stands for and why design is so central to its mission? [00:02:41] Speaker C: Yes, of course. AICA is a small group. Our membership is limited to 60 members, and we focus on improving design in the industry. We work on other things as well. Sales, business ethics, sculpture, research, craftsmanship. But design is what started us and what we continue to do. Our primary focus. The founders of AICA were concerned that the industry was getting a bit monotonous, rows of surf top monuments and a lack of creativity. And so they joined together to form the American Institute of Commemorative Art. To promote the artistic side of memorial design. [00:03:28] Speaker A: Interesting. So design trends in monuments are always changing. What trends are emerging now and what you think is driving that? [00:03:39] Speaker C: You know, this year's design contest for aica, we saw a lot more unusual shapes, angular shapes, saw what I thought were a lot of triangles in some of the designs. And so I think there's certainly a move to more contemporary design. I think people are looking for something special, out of the ordinary to mark the graves of their loved ones, something that isn't run of the mill. I think perhaps the other thing that helps drive it is manufacturing costs. With the latest technology, it's easier to manufacture unusual shapes. And so what used to be a very expensive proposition isn't quite as expensive as it used to be. [00:04:27] Speaker A: Sure. You know, it's interesting that you mentioned the term contemporary. We talk about contemporary design, traditional design. Those are terms that have been used probably for 75 years now, right? [00:04:43] Speaker C: Yes. [00:04:45] Speaker A: When is contemporary become traditional? What do you think? [00:04:51] Speaker C: Well, perhaps that's what's happening is that contemporary things are becoming more usual and we'll have to find a new term in the future. [00:04:59] Speaker A: Right. So what design mistakes you see repeated most often in our industry and what is usually behind most mistakes? Is it a skills gap, time gap or something else? [00:05:13] Speaker C: You know, perhaps it's the training I received from your father, but I see more instances of text being misused, inscriptions on memorials not being well proportioned so often, just too big, overpowering the layout and the composition, and particularly not well spaced, not well kerned. I think it might be sort of a skills gap. We people assume the computer knows how to do these things and that it must be correct. But those of us that used to use a triangle and a T square know that adjustments have to be made. And so I think perhaps that's what I see most today, a lack of skillful typography. When you had to draw letters by hand, you were more in tune with it. Proper spacing. And now, of course, you just type it out and it's supposed to be okay. [00:06:12] Speaker A: Right. I think, you know, it's if, if you follow the analogy, it's like using a saw or a drill. Right. A saw is designed to cut a drill's design to make a hole, but if you don't know how to wield the tool properly, you're not going to get a straight line or, or even hole in your cut. And the computer is kind of the same thing. Right. [00:06:37] Speaker C: It, you know, it's a wonderful tool, but it is only that it is a Tool. And it depends on the operator's skill. Their eye. I was going to say talent. And certainly there's an element of talent in design, but many elements of memorial design can be learned. [00:06:58] Speaker A: Absolutely. And I think that you're right. It's not necessarily one person is better than another, but it's maybe one person is more informed than another. One person recognizes that there are areas. You know, you mentioned kerning or leading white space, those kind of things. Understanding those concepts and how to improve them with the tool that is computer is. Is really the key, right? [00:07:33] Speaker C: Yes. Oh, yes. I mean, I don't miss drawing letters by hand, generally speaking. Do you? [00:07:39] Speaker A: I still am drawing letters by hand. So the short answer is no. [00:07:43] Speaker C: But I certainly don't miss cutting letters by hand. I'm happy to let a stencil cutter take care of that. [00:07:50] Speaker A: Yes, I will agree with that 100%. [00:07:53] Speaker C: But it is rather fun to be able to quickly try something on a computer and erase it and. And begin again. That's much more difficult on paper. [00:08:04] Speaker A: It surely is. It surely is. So we're excited to announce something new today. The design module of the NBNA's newest program. And help me out, Chad. What are we calling it? [00:08:22] Speaker C: Isn't it the design module of the Monument Builders Academy? Do I have that right? [00:08:28] Speaker A: Thank you, Jeff. Okay, so the design module is the second course of the Monument Builders Academy. What is this module, who is it for, and what problem is it solving for the Monument builders? [00:08:41] Speaker C: You know, Mike, you and I have been working long and hard on this, and I am excited about this particular module especially. It's aimed at anyone who's involved in memorial design. Of course, the operators of a CAD system or design software, but it's equal, equally adaptable for sales staff. They're going to be working with families, helping them make decisions about what's going to go on it, guide them to make beautiful memorials. I think office staff can benefit from this design module. In my company, all of the staff used to do proofreading. And so if they have some background in design, it certainly helps make the memorials look better. You know, shop personnel that are putting the stencil on, even the sand, those that are sandblasting. If they have some design training, they might be able to catch mistakes before they're permanently etched in stone. And so I think it can make everyone in a monument company be more aware of good design. [00:09:47] Speaker A: I think you're right, Jed. And I believe that that's really the whole premise behind the entire Monument Buildings Academy. There's information there for the people in the particular niches of our industry, but there's also information for those that are not in those particular niches so that they understand how all the pieces are together and how other people that they work alongside, how their role and your role and everyone else's function fit together. To take a family who's come in to memorialize a loved one and follow their journey all the way to the memorial being set in the cemetery. And I think that, you know, oftentimes there's a disconnect from one area of focus to another. And I think this is one of the other overarching ideas behind the academy is to bring some of that information into everybody's purpose. [00:10:57] Speaker C: Absolutely. Taking a family's feelings and thoughts and putting them into a memorial design is difficult. And having other people understanding the process in your company certainly makes for a better finished memorial. One of the things I'm most excited about in this module is the self inspection worksheet. I forget what the actual title is, but a sheet that helps you review and critique your own design work reminds you of some things that you ought to be looking for. And I think that's a terrific thing. It wasn't unusual in my company for someone to raise their hand and say I think this floor arrangement is a little off or I don't think the kerning here is proper. And so having this self inspection sheet just allows us to think about what we've done and to do a quick review before we call it complete. [00:12:00] Speaker A: Yeah, I'll. I'll have to confess, I don't remember what we're calling that either. There's so much information and material that we covered in creating the, the, the program that, that the actual term is lost with me as well. But the idea of giving people another way to look at your own work and find the weak spots or the strong spots as well, you know, it's not always finding what you did wrong, but also finding what you did right and building upon that. So I think definitely this is going to be a part of the program that's going to be of a lot of benefit to people. [00:12:44] Speaker C: The other thing I think is really nice is that this is an online course. It can be done at one's own pace as time allows. [00:12:52] Speaker A: You can. [00:12:52] Speaker C: You could do a part of the module and then pick it up again later. So I think it will fit into most monument companies ability to schedule it. You don't have to block out a huge amount of time to take the course. You can do it in parts, yeah. [00:13:09] Speaker A: I think that, you know, for those of us who sat for hours at convention taking the dreaded CM exam, on paper, it's nothing like that at all. This isn't your dad's CM exam. [00:13:30] Speaker C: That's very true. [00:13:32] Speaker A: But the idea is to provide information and learning experience for a company, for seasoned employees, for new employees, for people, people that are doing this particular job or people that aren't. Again, like I said before, just to get. Give everyone a more rounded understanding of the entire process. [00:13:58] Speaker C: Yes. Even those that are more experienced. It's always good to pause and do a review, but it's going to be useful for anyone, any of your staff to take. [00:14:09] Speaker A: Yeah, I, I think that's right. And, and I think that's an important thing to point out. You know, you've got a number of years under your belt serving in this industry, so do I. And there has been something in every single module that has been an eye opener to me, you know, or it's raised a question that I didn't have before. So, you know, to think, you know, I've done this my whole life, there isn't anything I'm going to learn. Sorry, that is not the right mindset. There's something in these programs for everybody. [00:14:48] Speaker C: That's right. Anyone that wants to improve themselves and what they're doing, these modules will be helpful. [00:14:56] Speaker A: Yeah. So is there a particular skill or mindset shift you hope to builders take away from engaging with this content? [00:15:04] Speaker C: Do you know, for me, I think one of the most important things is once I have finished a layout, I like to pause, read about what I was supposed to be doing and look at the screen or the printout and say, did I do that? We just have to pause and see that the entire composition is harmonious. Does it answer our clients needs? You know that I did mostly flat grass markers my career and people will say, well, what can you do with that? Well, the challenge for me of course was every, every layout I looked at it and thought, how can I make it better? And if we can get that kind of mindset going, it will improve our work. One percent this month, maybe another percent next month. And after a while we've done great improvements. [00:15:58] Speaker A: Yeah, I agree. And I want to key on the other thing that you mentioned, the pause. Right. I think that if your business is like our business, there's always the push to meet deadlines, to exceed customers expectations. But I don't think I can express the importance of the pause, especially in design. You know, when you start working on a Layout, and you're into it and you're. You've got your tunnel vision and you're focused on getting everything there from start to finish. And you know you've got another one coming and another one after that. Sometimes, unfortunately, it can be a race to finish. But if you take and you complete that design and you set it aside, I don't care if it's for 20 minutes or five minutes or the next day, and you open that up and take a look at it with fresh eyes, I can almost guarantee there's something that you're going to say. I can make this little adjustment, and, boy, isn't that going to make a difference. [00:17:11] Speaker C: It's so true. At least for me. Creativity doesn't work under pressure. There are people that respond better to pressure, but I find creativity often needs some time. And setting aside a design and looking at it again, one of my favorite things was we usually had three or four people proofread it before we would colorize it. And so it would come back to me perhaps that same day or later the next day. And it's new. Okay. Is this any good? [00:17:45] Speaker A: Yeah. And, you know, I don't know about you, but seeing it with my new eyes, I become one of my harshest critics. You know, that's true. [00:17:57] Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah. [00:17:58] Speaker A: Just looking at it again, not like something that I created, but something that's there to be digested and understood. So. So for a monument builder who's never thought of themselves as a designer, what's the first small step they could take this week to start thinking differently about the design side of their. [00:18:21] Speaker C: This was a hard question, and I thought about it a lot, and I think it's balance and layout. Have I balanced the positive space? You know, the things we're adding onto the monument, does it balance with the negative space, the space we're not using? Does it flow? Is it harmonious? Is it too cluttered? Something that happens a lot. On the other hand, it shouldn't be too simple, but I think to try to make sure that everything is balanced and well proportioned. Harmonious is the word I think I would use most often. Have we achieved that kind of look? And I think that's something you can start today. It's very easy to just say, have I got too much going on? [00:19:16] Speaker A: Yeah, I think that that's a great takeaway, Jed. When you think about it, you know, most designers will say, did I include everything that the family asked for? Right. But I think that when you think about the layouts, the designs that are really impactful. It's as much about what you didn't include or the negative space, the white space that we talk about that remains. Right. Is there enough to give meaning to the elements that we included? Right. [00:19:57] Speaker C: Well said. Absolutely. [00:19:59] Speaker A: If you take away one thing from this podcast is the idea to consider. Did I leave enough open area? Did I leave enough surrounding what is important to show that it is important? [00:20:16] Speaker C: Yes, yes, absolutely. [00:20:19] Speaker A: So what else? Tell me a little bit more about the guts of the design module. Can give the listeners a little bit of a sneak peek. [00:20:31] Speaker C: So there are as this space we've talked about, positive negative space is talked about composition. Do we have all of the elements there? Do they flow nicely? We talk about the use of lettering, the use of textures, how we can emphasize areas. Gosh, what else did we. We've covered so many things in that module. Yeah, it's a really good overview. One book that I've often used is this silly book. It's not going to show Design Basics Index. And you know what? We've condensed this big thick book into one module about how to lay out a memorial, how to size things appropriately and introducing textures as white space. It's a really good, good overview of some very long courses I've sat in before. [00:21:36] Speaker A: Sure. And again, I think that, you know, if you're, if you're expecting the design module to be all encompassing, A to Z, everything you're going to need to be the designer of the future, that's not what this is. Right. This is a nice, well rounded dip of the toe that gives everybody again, whether you're the designer in your company or you're not, just some things to think about and to remember. [00:22:13] Speaker C: Absolutely. It is a wonderful, well rounded overview. This is not a PhD course in design. This is a basic course. But it's very, it is well rounded. It covers all of the important subjects. [00:22:30] Speaker A: I think so, yeah. And, you know, a nod to Troy Caldwell who has led us through this. You know, we are not going to share with the audience the number of hours, the man hours, the woman hours, the people hours that have gone into the Monument Builders Academy, because there's just no way to tally them. But it's been a labor of love. I think it will be something that can be built upon going forward if we desire more in depth in any of those areas. But it's something that people have been begging for for as long as I can remember. So I'm very pleased that we're finally out of the talking about it phase and ruminating and the arguing and the trying to get it going, to actually see it some fruit from our labors, which is tremendous. [00:23:32] Speaker C: It is the one thing I miss about having my company is that I want, I want to put all of my employees through these programs. [00:23:40] Speaker A: Sure. [00:23:41] Speaker C: So I've encouraged my son to do so. We'll see what he chooses to do. But as we worked on these courses, I thought, oh wow, why didn't we have this some time ago? [00:23:53] Speaker A: Well, I think with that, it's time to draw today's podcast to a close. So I'd like to thank today's guest, Jed Hendrickson and our podcast audience for taking time out of their day to day share. The Monument Builders Academy Design course is now online, so I encourage you to review the course material and consider this as a training resource for your team. To learn more about AICA, you can go online to www.monuments-aica.com. if you have a topic you'd like to have covered in a future podcast, please leave a comment here. Right so thanks for listening. Today's installment of Monument Matters MB&A invite you to stay connected Through Facebook and LinkedIn or visit us at www.monimalbuilders.org for upcoming events and webinars for MB&A and Monument Matters. I'm Michael Johns. Thank you for taking time out of your day to listen in. If you found today's content worthwhile, please share the link with a friend friend for comments and feedback. As I said, we'd love to hear from you, so please drop a note to infoindmitbuilders. Please remember to mark your calendars now because the 2027 Mining Industry show will be in Mobile, Alabama February 25th to 28th. And I want to thank the women in MDNA for giving me the helm back to our podcast. They did a great job, but I want to keep my day job. Thanks again for joining us. Bye now. [00:25:25] Speaker C: Take care. [00:25:39] Speaker A: Of.